Desert Island Tricks
Each week we invite one of the biggest guests in the world of magic to maroon themselves on a desert island. They are allowed to take with them 8 tricks, 1 book, 1 banishment and 1 non magic item that they use for magic! We discuss their 'can't live without' lists and why those items were chosen.
Episodes are uploaded every Friday and are available via all Podcast service providers!
To find out more about the team behind Desert Island Tricks, please visit: www.alakazam.co.uk
Desert Island Tricks
Harry De Cruz
The motorbike appears four feet from the front row. A lady floats just beyond the lip of the stage. That proximity rewires what audiences believe about illusion and it’s exactly where Harry DeCruz loves to live: smiling, present, and letting pure astonishment carry the room.
We dive into Harry’s journey from creative consultant to centre-stage performer, drawing on years with Derren Brown, Dynamo, and major West End productions. That backstage pressure, writing predictions, guarding contingencies, built a calm that now anchors his stage work. He explains why Ring Flight felt like real magic as a child, how Sneak Thief becomes a playground for storytelling (tattoos, perfumes, nicknames), and why stack work turns a deck into a quiet superpower. We unpack his silent celebrity painting reveal, an “invisible” drawing dusted into view and the subtle design choices that make silhouettes land from the stalls to the balcony.
Then the dials turn up. Harry walks us through building a paintball bullet catch: rehearsing in a builder’s yard, safety layers that still leave bruises, and a presentation that balances danger with humour. We go deep on translating Dynamo’s phone-in-bottle from TV to arena stage, custom labels, bottle tolerances, timing, and choreography that lets the miracle read clean and fast. And we explore the “annoyingly perfect” mass phone effect that detonates in any room, giving every spectator a personal climax they can verify on their own device.
Throughout, Harry champions props and methods that feel organic and modern, pushing back on dated optics that hold magic back. We talk books and real study (annotating Derren Brown’s Notes from a Fellow Traveller), the value of a trusted WhatsApp braintrust that pressure-tests ideas, and why the Young Magicians Club’s supportive culture is shaping the next wave of performers.
If you care about building miracles that stand up at close range and still crush in a theatre, this conversation is a masterclass in design, discipline, and delight.
Harry’s Desert Island Tricks:
- Ring Flight
- Sneak Thief
- Deck of Cards in Mnemonica
- Silent Painting Routine
- Spooked
- Paintball Bullet Catch
- Phone in Bottle
- TOXIC +
Banishment. Being More Mindful of Props / Large Ring on Rope
Book. Notes From a Fellow Traveller
Item. Phone with his Whatsapp Group Chat
Find out more about the creators of this Podcast at www.alakazam.co.uk
It's it's such fun to be out here and also getting to have the stage time as well is huge for me. I'm learning so much because I'm basically doing Jamie's show, and so I'm sort of learning from Jamie's 30-year career. And also a lot of stuff's not I I wouldn't perform anyway. And so I get to do illusions, I get to fly and levitate a girl each night and make a motorbike appear. It is such fun. The resident director here sort of said how when Jamie does it, he's sort of got like a bit of like a mysterious snarl on, and you're you've got this massive smile. What's going through your head here? And I'm just going, just laughing. I'm just having so much fun. This is crazy. Are you ready for this? It's like this kind of I'm forgetting through the mysteriousness because I'm just enjoying the insanity of it all. Having watched the show and being in that space where Jamie's doing it, if you're a front row, you're having a motorbike appear four feet away from you, and they're that close, and a levitation a few feet as well. Like seeing it up close, you're so close to the stage. You mean the front row put their feet up on the stage often, so that's how close they are. It really changes the energy. The moment the curtain's open, they see a big box style illusion on the stage, changes the energy in the room. People are like, oh, here we go. This is where this is where the money's been spent.
SPEAKER_02:At the moment, he's actually dialing in right this second from New York very, very kindly. It's very early in the morning for him, so it's very nice for him to do it. He is super busy, he's over there doing something, which I'll tell you about in one minute, and hopefully we can find out a bit more about that as well. Now, today's guest has been a creative consultant, magic director, head of magic for high-profile productions, uh, for people like uh Darren Brown and his show Unbelievable at the Criterion in London, which was a phenomenal show. I really enjoy it. I saw it several times, brilliant show. Uh Dynamo, he's been uh with his World Tour, seeing us Believe in. He's helped with multiple acts on Britain's Got Talent and America's Got Talent, as well as West End shows and theatre productions. He was actually, we saw his performance in a competition last year at the Magic Circle, and I must admit, it was absolutely brilliant. And at the moment, he is starring in Amaze in New York, uh, which is Jamie Allen's show, and I've heard so many incredible reviews about his performance in it. Um, he's also one of the key players in the Young Magician's Club at the Magic Circle. Him and Edward Hilsom, who we've had on here, please do go check out Edward's episode because it was phenomenal. They have really turned the Young Magician's Club into something that the entire society should be incredibly proud of. So I'm very excited to find out what he has to say. Today's guest is the wonderful Harry DeCruz. Hello, Harry.
SPEAKER_00:Hello, that was very lovely of you. I get I get awkward when kids when I get compliments, but turns out I also get awkward when it's just saying what I've done. But you said it in a very lovely way, and um yeah, you pointed out so many things that I think mean a lot to me, like the YMC having a very accepting culture, and like whenever I watch how the kids support each other, I sort of always think that's what the circle needs to be, and that's what you know all adults need to be as well, because they're they're so lovely.
SPEAKER_02:That's why we need you just controlling the adults in the magic circle as well. But you are actually in New York at the moment and you are performing in Amaze. It would be remiss of me not to talk to you very quickly about that. How is it? Because I've heard some incredible things. Uh, I've heard lots of people and actually seen lots of people post saying that they've come to New York to see you in the show. So, what's it been like over there? What's the the culture like over there with magic?
SPEAKER_00:It's been great, it's been uh an absolute dream because you don't get to do stage much in the UK, and so suddenly getting having opportunity to be on stage most days here is so so rewarding, and the audiences are lovely, they are so responsive, they're up for magic, and they are um just so exciting, and it's it's such fun to be out here, and also getting to have the stage time as well is huge for me. I'm learning so much because I'm basically doing Jamie's show, as I'm not saying I'm Jamie Allen, but I'm doing his show and his material, and so I'm sort of learning from Jamie's 30-year career and uh all the tips and tricks and that kind of stuff. So there's a bit of a shortcut into these uh effects, and also a lot of the stuff's not I I wouldn't perform anyway. And so I get to do illusions, I get to fly and levitate a girl each night and make a motorbike appear, and um, it is such fun. The resident director here sort of said how they said they just said to me and Jamie, when Jamie does it, he's sort of got like a bit of like a mysterious snarl on, and you're you've got this massive smile. What you what's going through your head here? And I'm just going, Oh, I'm just laughing. I'm just having so much fun. Just going, This is crazy. Are you ready for this? It's like this kind of I'm forgetting to do the mysteriousness because I'm just enjoying the insanity of it all. So um, yeah, it's such fun out here, and uh, hopefully it continues for a long time.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I hope so too. I did actually hear another interview on another podcast, I think it may be Magician's Advice podcast, and they were saying that the venue that you're in is quite intimate, but the fact that you're doing these incredible illusions like levitations and motorbike appearances, the fact that it's in that intimate uh uh experience almost actually makes it more incredible, and it just feels even more impossible that those things are happening.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it is uh having watched the show and being in that space where Jamie's doing it, you're if you're front row, you're having a motorbike appear four feet away from you, and like it is that close, and the levitation a few feet as well, like seeing it up close. Um, when also any theatrical methods usually you sort of like go, oh it's just a big stage and I can't really tell what's going on. You're so close to the stage. You mean the front row put their feet up on the stage often, so that's how close they are. Um seeing it in that space, and also it it really changes the energy. The moment the curtains open, they see a big style, big box style illusion on the stage, it changes the energy in the room and feel like, oh, here we go. This is where this is where the money's been spent. Um, and so yeah, feeling that is exciting. I mean, I don't think I'll do illusions after this, it's still quite not my style, but it is so much fun to be doing, um, and especially in that room. Especially.
SPEAKER_02:Well, normally with theatre, I think it's fair to say you're quite a key player backstage a lot of the time. I know that we um run into you in my local theatre at the beginning of Darren's current show run um when you were running through some of those pieces, and even the dynamo show and obviously unbelievable, which was a brilliant, brilliant show. What's it been like sort of working backstage and consulting for those people and now that transition to being the person on stage?
SPEAKER_00:Working backstage on such a variety of projects has really helped my breadth of knowledge across all of all areas. Like I helped with Young and Strange as a stage hand, so I got to learn about illusions when I was like 14 years old, so like that really has helped these sorts of sort of things, and doing behind the stage on behind the scenes on TV magic helped me learn a lot about like certain gimmicks, and I've taken you you get to expand your knowledge massively, so that's really helped. Um, and also getting to see performers, like getting to watch Darren, get into watch him rehearse. You can't help but want to improve and improve by watching him perform. But yeah, the transition to stage has been just massively helped because of that experience having so much, so much flight time and viewing it, but also a lack of pressure. Like, I the amount of predictions that I've written off stage, or the amount of things I've done for other performers where like there's a lot of pressure on what if I don't do this correctly, it's gonna affect them on stage. It's made me quite comfortable with pressure, with kind of like going like things might go wrong. That that's a key thing, I think, early on, and also quite accepting as well for our stage group. I've been there. If it mucks up, I'm like, I've been there, don't you worry. So, yeah, it's really helped. It's really helped. I've not really realized that until um this job, really, about that sort of experience I've gathered.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think that leads us very nicely on a segue to your list. So you just mentioned obviously that you've had to get this wealth of knowledge with all of these projects that you're working with, and I did mention seeing your performance uh at the Close Up Magician of the Year, which I thought was just phenomenal. And obviously, you are a fantastic close-up performer. So, in terms of putting a list together, did you find that because of the new experiences and the new tricks that you've had to sort of delve into, have you found that that list might have changed and altered, or are these like your ride and dies? These are the things that you're always gonna keep with you.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I put a bunch of stuff that I that is close to me as a performer, but then also stuff that I feel fond of in terms of just my my journey, my story. Like either I'm proud of or like means a lot to me just as a trick. Um I think I'm quite I I I love magic as an industry. I love it. Whether I perform all effects or not, I love it. Like, I when I was a kid, I was very fortunate. We went to Las Vegas on a holiday family holder to save up for years to do so. And my mum took me to see Lance Burton, and he did the vanishing birdcage effect with me. And then when I was like 20 and I finally had some disposable income, I bought a vanishing birdcage just so I could never perform it, but have that as a prop. So I'm quite sentimental in that way. And so a few of these tricks I've chosen on the list are just they mean a lot to me in terms of my story and magic rather than me performing them. It's not my working set as such.
SPEAKER_02:Have you put them in a particular list? So have you gone from maybe like things that were the oldest to the newest? How have you structured your list?
SPEAKER_00:First trick trick that uh sort of well, you would say first proper trick, then it goes into uh the favourite to perform for like a theory reason. Then like my worker, something I'm a creation I'm proud of, a trick that was pivotal in my magic journey, a big thing I don't get to do much, very proud big effects, which you all know of, is everyone sort of in the country knows of, and then what I think annoyingly is the perfect trick.
SPEAKER_02:Wow, I think one thing that you just mentioned there is really interesting, and I don't believe we've had it on any episode before, which was the idea of choosing an effect for the theory side of it. So something about the theory of that trick is what engages you, which I think's really interesting.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it it's a plot that is versatile, and um see that's what I like about it, but we'll we'll come to it.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, let's give nothing more away. If this is your first time listening to the podcast, the idea is we're about to tamaroon Harry on his very own magical island. When he's there, he's allowed to take eight stricks, banish one item, take one book, and one non-magical item that he uses for magic particulars. Who's there, what's there, all of that good stuff we do not mind. It's in Harry's own imagination. So let's hop on that appearing motorbike and head to his island now. What's in your first position?
SPEAKER_00:My first trick is ring flight, which I'm aware is a sort of classic worker effect, uh, which is also why I'm fond of it. It sort of stands the test of time, I think. I think other tricks um, you know, that are workers can kind of be they can come and go. I think, but this seems to be around for a long time. It's basically the reason it's there is it's the first proper trick that I remember seeing as a kid, um, because I saw Paul Meagram, who uh also known as Colonel Custer, who was a kid's entertainer, who used to perform in his early, early days in like a crash area, like a like a kid's area of this furniture store when he was starting his career. And I used to want to go every weekend to go see him perform magic, and people do tricks, kids' tricks. But I remember him showing my mum and dad him doing ring flight and seeing my mum be impressed, and my mum and dad seeing their amazement made me realise oh, that is like what magic is and what it can do. And I remember that being such a pivotal point in my like interest in magic. You know, seeing our parents speechless at a young age is a very different sort of thing. They're the adults, they're always in control, and suddenly they're shocked and surprised and in love with this person. And I was like, So I think that to me is uh such a pivotal trick for me. I also think it's so strong because of how organic it is in terms of like I think in the same way Dynamo's phone and bottle really hit this country's like the zeingeist, everyone sort of remembered it. I think it was very pure. It was like he took a phone, he took a bottle, bam, it happens, and everyone sort of remembered that, and that's why people mentioned it so much to us at gigs and events through those years. I think this has a similar feeling to that, which is Burrow Ring vanishes and appears on the car keys. I think that is very memorable. I think that's why it's uh number one on my list. It means a lot that trick.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think that's a great choice sitting at number one. Now, two things that you said there. So the first thing is you mentioned like the organicness, and I think what's really interesting about a ring flight is it's so close to real magic because there's no props. The only prop is the ring. There, I mean technically the other prop is the keys, but it's an invisible prop because it's only used as the destination for it to go to. So I don't think there are many magic tricks in the industry where it that that's it. That you just it's just the ring. The ring disappears and appears somewhere else.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, exactly. And also the prop the the the keys element of the prop that is so organic. It's not quite not you know uh dismissing any other tricks, but it's not quite like it's in like a nest of wallets or it's in something that is uh a bit unusual or a bit proppy, but yeah, it fits that style so perfectly. Because I my preference as a performer is propless, um, or seemingly. I'd like it to be. I'm happy with cars and stuff because you're expecting a magician to have those things, but I'm not a big fan of having magic props, uh, which is actually a bit something I'm going to come on to later. Um, just sort of my how I want magic to come across, or how I want to come across. And so ring flight fits perfectly because it feels like a sort of in the moment sort of effect, it's and it's so strong.
SPEAKER_02:So let's talk about the kind of ring flight that you would prefer to use. So we've had ring flight mentioned quite a few times, and different people have different preferences of the kind of one that they want. Obviously, there is an industry leader quite recently. There's been lots of controversy about other versions. So, which version do you prefer to use and why?
SPEAKER_00:Mine is Dave Bonsorce uh Revolution, just it fits the most organic for me of uh uh being car keys. By the way, I also can't drive. Uh so um, which is also great because I get to choose whatever car brand I want. I'll have a Mercedes, please. Um, although I also remember having to like knock myself down a peg when I was 20 or whatever it was, going, I won't, I don't drive a Mercedes, I don't look like it. I'm 20, so I'd like to choose like a Fiat. Um so yeah, I I I can't drive, which is always kind of like people mention sometimes mention it as well. Oh, Mercedes or whatever. And I'm like, yeah, I know nothing about cars, but as far as they're concerned, I don't need to also I live in London usually, so wouldn't drive anyway. Um but I I like that just because it feels the most organic and the key looks the most familiar to everyone else, and yeah, and his customer service has always been great. I've had I've you know I've had sort of the same one for many, many years, and he's like MOT'd it for me. Um I just I prefer that to the other effects. Not I just not even really explore the other effect, the other ones, because I'm very happy with this one, but they all look very impressive.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, they are phenomenal. I quite like the idea of magicians going out and getting a Mercedes one just to show off during the performance and then hopping in their micro on the way home.
SPEAKER_00:Yes, I have I have half that, I have half that um imposter uh element.
SPEAKER_02:So well, that's a great one in number one. Let's find out what you put in your second position, what's in position two?
SPEAKER_00:So this is a trick, but it's a trick that this is the one I was mentioning about being versatile, is it's sneak thief. So Larry Becker's Sneak Thief um with Andy Nyman has put many touches on it over the years, and the reason I like it is first of all, small plays big. You can really, I mean, Darren did a version of it in his last tour. Um four bits of car, four pens, lovely. But for me, it's the fact that it's a plot or it's a method that you can do anything you want with. And I've got like five or six different presentations with it that I just love coming up with those premises. So, you know, I do a thing where they draw their tattoos and I'm guessing what their tattoos are, this is drawings, but also done a routine where they write down their perfumes and I go down smelling them and I'm getting and I work out this is I think your this is yours. I work out so as as a premise, you can do so much with it. X-ray vision, I can look through you. Write something down that's on you. It could be a tattoo, a birthmark, or even something in your pocket, and I've got x-ray vision, and I can look at you and work out, oh, this is yours. Obviously, there's loads of jokes within that. And then the final one is I scan the whole person and work out exactly what they would have written about them. Like, there's all these sort of premises about it, and I and I love that. It uh feels very stripped back as a plot as well, because it is just four bits of card. Um, yeah, it it hits so hard, and there's so many jokes with it. It faxball plays big in terms of time as well. You can get a lot of time out of it. There are some tricks out there, like I'm a huge fan of Blake Voigt and his creations, and he has an amazing trick with duct tape over his mouth, and it's a card, named any named card, and it's perfect for my style, but there's something about it that I the reason I haven't bought it yet is because I can't work out how to make it mine because it's so perfect, it's perfectly rounded. There's not much I can add to it without just doing his routine. Uh, so I love Sneak Thief for the reason that there is so much you can do about it, and that that to me is uh yeah, my number two big fan of that trick.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think it's a phenomenal trick, and there's so many wonderful versions out there. I know uh obviously Larry Becker's version. We've also got Mark Spellman has a version in um one of my favourites actually is in Nyman's recent lecture notes, which uses a mobile phone, which is a brilliant start to a show. Uh, and you referenced Darren's last year, uh, in his last tour, sorry, and I thought that was particularly wonderful because he managed to expand on the principle um in a way that I hadn't seen anyone do before. So my question is uh, and I just have to say as well, your version, the idea of the tattoos, love that. The amount of times at a gig someone will say, Can you tell me what tattoo I have?
SPEAKER_00:It happens so often. Oh, thank you. Yeah, it uh there's so much that can be done with it, which is so fun. Like it's also depending on the dynamic of the group. Like if you get a bit of a rowdy kind of uh corporate, you can do celebs that are like, you know, who would play you in a in a movie and that kind of stuff, just general just like questions that aren't just like write down a word. Um, but also there's one routine I had, which is um nicknames, which I'm very proud of, which is the idea, so I want you to write down a nickname you had at school. One but ideally not a cool one. It's what I asked the audience, like basically who was bullied. Okay. Uh but you're you need to be able to say this. You can't be uh opening up wounds. Uh but if you're willing to share with us uh something you recalled at school, they rhyme down. Then I look at them and I've now got to guess who this was. And so I'm looking at big nose and I've now got to look down the line, and it becomes incredibly awkward for me. And the audience are enjoying me squirming about this, and it's so you know, one I'll look at and kind of go, I don't I'm not even gonna say that publicly. This is yours, go back to your seat, sort of thing. So that just like creates this thing, and then also the final point is I know we know this is yours, don't know what it is. I've then got to look at them and judge them and work out what they were bullied for. And it's like, if I get this wrong, I'm offending this person. So there's so much fun to be had with it. Um, yeah, that's my that's my favorite one because I'm squirr-like, genuinely sweating and squirming the whole way through because I don't know what they're gonna write, and I've had some horrendous ones before that I turn over on stage and like, whoa, nope, that can't be said on stage. I'm gonna get cancelled if there's a photo of this. But yes, but I think Darren did do it, I think possibly the best by expanding it. Um, I'm a big fan, and kind of it was perfect. I think I saw that show so many times, and it was just as solid every single time.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think that's a great one in at number two, and leads us very nicely on to number three. So, what's in your third spot?
SPEAKER_00:This is my sort of worker thing, which is a deck of cards in stack. I am a huge fan of stack work. I work in mnemonica, uh, and also learning my own stack as well, which my advice to anyone learning one is just you've got to keep doing it, you just got to carry on doing it. But the challenge with that is if you're learning a stack, relearning a different one, then you kind of go, at what point do you transfer over to learning doing that every day? Um, but I love it because of the versatility on the fact I can just go in any direction. Like I'm I'm in full control the whole time. So if like if a card is lost, or if a spectator's a bit annoying, or if um they want to do either shuffle the cards or put the card back in, or whatever, any of these kind of things, I'm aware of what the card is from the start, but also what else I can do and where I can go with it. Um, you know, if someone like a group just randomly names a card, I can get to it in a second and put it in my pocket, and I like that feeling of um just being sort of in control, and it means I can relax a lot because I've got this sort of um arsenal in my pocket of you know, of great effects versatile.
SPEAKER_02:So I did warn you that this was gonna happen, Harry DeCruz, and it's about to happen. Devil's Advocate has popped up. He's here to say hello. Uh and he says if you were to perform just one routine with your deck of cards in the moniker, what is that one routine that you would perform? Ooh.
SPEAKER_00:Can I choose one close-up one stage? Of course you can. Close-up is um just uh spectator cuts to the card, which I do with like an as he wins um from his book Repertoire. Just they name a card, I say just cut the cards wherever you want, and it's and it's the card they cut to. Feels very pure, very clean, very straightforward. Uh so I love that for that. But um on stage, like a weighing, a Pit Hartling weighing cards routine where the audience picks up map cards and you know they drop in your hand and you know how many there are, and then you do that a couple of times, and then you can prove that you can memorize them as well in that order. And so that to me, because I love the blending the skills and the magic together. Something I've noticed with doing stack work is that you just get better over the years doing it, of course, but like things like estimation, like I'm actually pretty spot on with it now, just because I've done so many cuts to the right to the right number of cards. Like at the Magician's Table, the show I used to do in London, I would do three mnemon uh mnemonica tricks at the start, at the top, really quick fire within the first two minutes, and each one of them involves me cutting to the card, which means I was doing that you know 30 times a night. I was doing that uh six nights a week, and I so I got good from gigs, but doing it, drilling it that much, I was like quite proud of it, I think, as well. I you you can see you can feel yourself getting good and getting better, and I think a lot of tricks out there, I love sort of electronic mentalism stuff, but you're not quite responsible for the trick. You're responsible for the presentation, the performance, but the trick is doing it for you. But this I feel very proud of in terms of I'm working hard here. Um, and also someone found out the method, or like I told my partner the method, like I I've memorized every card to every number, every number to every card. I'm in control of it, I can estimate this, and I'm palming this off in this moment. Like, I feel proud that that makes me feel like a proper like magician, magician, as opposed to um I got a buzz.
SPEAKER_02:In terms of learning your stack then, I know you touched on it earlier on. There's so many performers, me included, who the the thought of memorising a deck of cards is daunting, absolutely daunting. Is there any advice that you would give to me and everyone else who wants to get into stack work?
SPEAKER_00:Yes. So, first of all, there's a few things. I would say I would say learn your own stack. I would say, so um come up with what you want the effects to be out of it and kind of go, so I oh, this would be really useful. And also seems to be people named the Queen of Hearts, not put the Queen of Hearts easily accessible, like these kind of things, or work out like what tricks you would regularly want to do with it, I think. Um I learned mnemonica initially because it's what every well so many magicians do, so it feels like um we're all on the same page there. But having done it for now over 10 years, I kind of go, I don't think there's very many mnemonica-specific effects. Um don't don't stick to one method of memorising cards. Get your friends to help you do silly things to memorize certain cards, um, draw fades, like make the court cards into people you know and think of their age. And David Blaine in my head is 31 because he is the king of spades on his deck of cards and he's like things like this. So don't just uh stick to one method, uh yeah, and get your friends to challenge you because that really helps. Um and then the main method is I found write I don't know, it's a podcast you can't see, but write the numbers of the card on the back of the cards, and then shuffle them face up and face down, and then you go through that deck, and you're now doing the face on the back of every single card. So you look at the back, and you see the back is 21. You turn it, you got three of spades, you turn it over and it's right, put it to the back, and you go through the whole deck each time, and you're now doing the front and back number and card. Um, just keep doing it, and the answer is you have to just keep doing it constantly for a year and eventually it becomes second agent. But now it means I can look at a deck that's in stack and I can notice the order in the same way. If you looked like an alphabet or you looked at a string of numbers, you would just go, Well, that 13, 14 are the wrong way. You just you could to me it's exactly the same as looking at the alphabet now.
SPEAKER_02:Well, that's great advice, and uh, I mean, it's a great choice. Thanks for giving both of those options to Mr. Devil. He has disappeared for now. Um, but that leads us to number four. So, what's in your fourth spot?
SPEAKER_00:My fourth spot is a trick that I created uh back in 2017, 2016, 2017 for my fringe show, my Edinburgh Fringe show. Um, and it's on the list because I'm proud of it. It's a creation and it's stuck with me my whole my whole career now. Um, and the trick is a spectator in the audience uh Thinks of a celebrity, and I explain the premise of 20 questions when you oh so the first premise is like how magical like our phones are and there's apps on our phone, I don't know how they work. One of them being 20 questions, where you think of a celebrity and it guesses who you're thinking of within 20 questions. I'm trying to learn that become the human 20 questions machine. So I ask someone to think of a celebrity and I then play openly 20 questions and ask them questions about their person until I get close to what I think it might be. And then I've got a flip chart on a stage, and I take a glue stick and I sort of draw on the on the board and then on the flip chart with the glue stick. You can't see what I'm drawing because it's clear glue. I then sprinkle it with cloco powder, tip it up, and it reveals a painting of that celebrity. Um, and I'm very proud of it because I think presentationally it fits. Uh, it's also very different from other effects. It has a nice little silent moment when I'm painting, so that's quite theatrical. Uh, the audience are playing along with it in the moment, and there's some good jokes within it. Uh, it's just something that's stuck around with me my career now, and I think that having that sort of trick that is very differently unique is what's got me a few different spots in different sort of shows and performances and lineups. So, yeah, that is a trick I'm very proud of.
SPEAKER_02:It had to be on the list. How do you even go about creating a routine like that?
SPEAKER_00:The initial starting point was actually um 20th century phantom, you know, the cut-out, you know, the cut out. And I had this idea of uh on a flip chart size, and the idea was I take I paint on the flip chart loads of splodges of colour, like a bit yellow at the top and pink there, red there, and black there and stuff, and it just looks like a mess. Then I take another piece of paper and I cut, cut, cut, cut, cut, unfold it and hold it over the colours, and now the colours fill in the gaps. Because usually 20th century, you hold over you know your black jacket or something to show the silhouette. But my idea was to hold over the colours, and you see the yellow of Marilyn Monroe's hair and the red of her lipstick or something. So I had a big stencil made to be able to do that trick so I can cut out flip chart size paper, and then because it was a stencil, I thought, oh, could I draw? And then I was like, ah, what if I was to use it as a method secretly? And that's when the idea of um drawing it came up, and then making it more theatrical. I can't just draw and just trace because also Darren had just done like the painting as well. Um, so it sort of went, like, how do I make this unexpected as a drawing? Because Darren done upside down. So it was sort of like, what if this was somehow invisible? Um yeah, and then chocolate powder seemed like a sort of sweet addition to it. Um, very sort of cutesy. I was young when I came up with it and uh just to suck around, very proud of it.
SPEAKER_02:Do you have any clips of you performing this? Is there anywhere that people can go and see it?
SPEAKER_00:I don't know if there are I do have clips of meat, but I don't know if they it's on uh you can see images on my Instagram of it, definitely. Uh sort of reveal moment or something up. Um one of the reasons it's not out there too much is because without talking about method, I have a preferred celebrity that I like that I hope comes up often. Uh let's say. Uh and so that's why the full effect isn't online. Um, and also that it can be, I can make it where it can be many other people. But having done it so much of this celebrity, the jokes that are in the 20 questions that keep it flowing, are like really well structured. And also, it's also very difficult to find celebrities that have good silhouettes in their image that have the right number of questions. Because you can get to you can get to Michael Jackson within like five questions if you ask the right things, but also not everyone, not all kids know who David Bowley is these days, and also yeah, right, and also interesting silhouettes, like Leonardo DiCaprio looks like just a normal person in a silhouette. There's nothing about him, and so there is a little bit of magic method and license in trying to ensure it is a good trick in terms of reveal at the end.
SPEAKER_02:Those are like the intricate points that you don't think about with a trick like that, like something as fundamental as just a silhouette of someone, those are the things that you just don't think that has to be a really recognizable thing.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, if you tip it up and you go, you know, legend Leonard DiCaprio, and they go, Okay, sure, I guess it I guess it is. He's got eyes. Um, so that's a big part of it, yeah. Those little details. And I and I love the fact I'm still learning, I'm still discovering that trick and tweaking it and perfecting it and yeah, working out how long I can be silent painting for. That is making it theatrical, but also not boring because they are watching me essentially draw nothing. Um and so are you just leaving the you can talk amongst yourselves. That's why I had to make the list.
SPEAKER_02:Well, it's a great choice in at number four. Let's move on to number five. What's in your fifth spot?
SPEAKER_00:This is Nick Einhorn's Nicholas Einhorn spooked, which is a haunted deck effect that happens at a distance, the card's on the floor, and I think it's a I think haunted decks are great, very, very magical. Uh again, different feeling from other effects because somehow, you know, you're moving the inanimate, uh, and it's very memorable, and it's so memorable uh for me. I remember seeing this at my uh YMC junior day when I was in 2004, uh, and Nick Einhorn did this, he was the lecturer, which also meant that when Edward and I took over YMC our first year, we wanted him back for this reason. Um it was he borrowed my deck of cards. I remember I can tell you exactly where I was in the Magic Circle Devant room. I was 10 years old. He borrowed my deck of cards and performed this effect, and I saw the shadow from the lights move the cards, shoot the cards, and the card popped out. And it was the first time that I saw a magician do an effect, not with his props. So, or not with any of his belongings. So, sure I'd seen Ring Flight, but like it's still his key. I knew something was going on there. I'd seen it enough times where I knew something about that was with the magician's props, and you know, all the other effects are my cards, my things, and everything else. Um whereas this was he but he had nothing, he had nothing, he borrowed my cards and performed this miracle, and that really hit hard for me of what magic could be. Um, and that's why it's just I I have I I'm so fond of it as a trick. I think it's so strong. I love it.
SPEAKER_02:Simple as that. Yeah, it's such a wonderful, wonderful routine. Now, how do you perform it? Are are you doing it with the shadow? Are you doing it spookily? Are you doing it whimsically?
SPEAKER_00:I don't perform it, I just love it as a trick. I love it. I have done the haunted deck with loops before, but I don't. I just I I'm I guess maybe I'm a bit nervous of it in terms of the actual methods. Um, but part of me just quite I'd be up for performing it one day. Just I just never I think I've never really explored this. I think I quite like my relationship with that trick being a fan. Like I think I quite same with um Guy Hollingworth's Reformation. I'm never gonna perform that. So I actually don't fully want to know all the ins and outs of how it was done. I want to just uh admire it and love it. Yes, I don't perform through. I'm not against performing it, I would in a heartbeat. I just haven't because I think being scared of the method, but also I just an appreciation. It's the moment you asked that, I was like, yeah, why don't I? Um I'm so fond of it, but I've never performed it. Yeah. Not sure. I've got friends of mine who perform it, and I see it kill. Just I don't, and I think I like that.
SPEAKER_02:You know what? I think that's fine. I really do. I think I think there's something really sweet in just having that trick. And I mean, I I think it's probably the story that you you spoke about, how you were young and you saw this amazing piece of magic, and I'm sure there are untold amount of performers who remember that trick. And it that that first trick or one of those first tricks probably really sticks with people as well. Um, but I think it's probably that relationship with that trick with you as well, the fact that you know, maybe it's nice to retain that magic to an extent.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I think so. I think I've just got such yeah, when I when I think of that trick, I don't think about like how will I perform it or what would I do with it. I just think about that memory, that that feeling, and so that's why I've just never even explored the idea of it. Um, but Nick does I've I've done, I still work with Nick at multi-man gigs most years, and um, I see him perform it and it it's just phenomenal. And he does it so well, and yeah, but then I think the shadow for me, I think, feels like the perfect version of it. Seeing, you know, whether you or the spectator's shadow move it, it just it's incredible, and the distance as well, the distance, the fact that it's not moving in sync with your hands. Um, you know, it's not sort of a loops version of as you move, they move. It doesn't feel like that because of the distance and part of the method. So uh it's very falling, very, very falling. Also, I think Matthew Lamotte one year showed me many years ago, he had a version which cleaned itself up at the end, which was like so falling. So everything happens, and then you just pick up the card and they they can pick up the cards. I remember seeing that. It was like really clever.
SPEAKER_01:Hey guys, Harry here from Alakazam Magic. I hope you're enjoying the podcast. I'm just here to interrupt and tell you a little bit about the Alakazam Magic Convention. It has taken us 35 years to get to this date. However, May the 9th, 2026 will be the very first Alakazam Magic Convention. Now, I know you guys are super excited, maybe just as excited as we are. First of all, the venue is a 37-minute direct train from central London. The venue is then literally a 10-minute walk from the train station. There's hotels within a stone's road, there's restaurants nearby, and there's incredible food and drink on site. That's all without even getting into the magic side of things. We are gonna have four incredible lecturers performing throughout the day, including one person who's gonna be flying over to the very first UK lecture. We are buzzing to announce who those four are. Not only that, there'll be dealers on site and a place for you guys to jam and session and meet new friends. Where are the lectures gonna be held? This is my personal favorite bit about the Alakazam Convention. They're gonna be happening in one of the cinema screens. That means fully tiered seating, comfy seats, a drinks holder, and there will be a close-up camera on the jumbo cinema screen that will be giving you close-ups of all the little nuances that you're gonna need to see when the lecturers are performing. There will, of course, be a full gala show to end the evening off. You guys are not gonna want to miss it. The great thing is as well, on the Sunday, the day after, Alakazam Magic Shop, which is a two-minute drive, will be open. So if you're heading down to the convention, why not stay overnight and come and visit our magic shop? Remember, May the 9th, 2026, tickets on sale now at Alakazam.co.uk. See you guys soon.
SPEAKER_02:I think that's a great choice. Uh, and I think it's really nice that that's not going to be one that you perform on your island. Maybe we need to give you a guest um to perform for you. Maybe we'll we'll give you Nick. He can come to the island with you.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I mean, I don't yeah, perform. I mean, I've been very nervous performing in front of him, but I'd like he can teach me all the ins and outs. And also, I'm sure he's got countless stories of it going wrong because that is a trick that can go wrong. And there is uh as well, I think it's a very brave trick to perform as well, I think, for that reason. Um he must have countless stories, and uh, I love bad gig stories.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe that should be one thing that we add to the the podcast in future iterations. We'll do um one horror story that you can forget for forever.
SPEAKER_00:Get Noel Qualter on, but for bad gig stories, he can do your series, he'll do he'll do a 24-part series, each one three hours long, and he'll non-stop gig stories.
SPEAKER_02:That's gonna be our next podcast, I think. Just Noel telling us those stories. Great. Well, that's a great choice in at number five. Let's move on to number six, then. What's in your six spot?
SPEAKER_00:Six is a um a trick that I so I in back in 2021, I got hired to be in champions of magic to go out to Saudi Arabia to perform, which is controversial, I know. Um and I had this act where I was doing like party tricks and skills, which I've always loved, but they didn't want that, they wanted magic, and so I had to create a magic effect that was still in my world of skillful things, and so and also it was a big arena show. And so I came up with a paintball bullet catch, um, and came up with a method and worked on it with uh a few friends. Simon Lippkin Master helped me stage it. Will Houston helped me um with went to his house and went found a builder's yard nearby, bought the builders a pack of beer, and said, Can we go outside in your yard and practice this trick with a paintball gun? And they said yes, and so Will started shooting me in a paint in a builder's yard. Uh, and then Jonathan Goodwin helped me work on this massively too, because he understands that kind of effect, you know, stunts and uh tension more than anyone else. And yeah, we created this bullet catch with a painful gun, and I'm so proud of it. Uh, it feels very, very different from anything else. Uh, I did a show last year, this year, and did a good big theatre show, but it ended up big curtains opening, and there's a big effect at the end. I don't get to perform it often because of that reason. It's so it takes a lot of tech and scale and rehearsals. Um, but very proud of it, and then had to make the list.
SPEAKER_02:So, with a routine like a paintball bullet catch, number one, it must be incredibly scary to practice um because the the nuances I'm presuming that are needed to make that work must be substantial. There must there must be so much involved in doing it. So, how do you go about practicing something like that?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, buy a builder, a pack of beer helps. Um well, also it is very scary because in this version of mine, I'll talk you through the plot, it's very simple, but there's one thing I think that makes it a bit different from others. I demonstrate how fast paintball is. Also, the presentation also, which I'll sort of come back to a little bit, uh throughout the show, I've mentioned my love for uh the S Club 7 star Rachel Stevens. Um, as a child, I loved her, and even as an adult, and so I then um put a poster of her on the wall and I'm stood in front of it to protect her. Um, but a paintball is signed by an audience member, loaded into uh there's a paintball garden, and the chamber is a clear tube, and you can see there's like seven or eight green paintballs. Their signed yellow paintball goes on it, and the two on top, so you can see it in the chamber the whole time and on the camera the whole time. The paintballs are I'm I go and I'm I've done it blindfolded before and I've done it not blindfolded, but uh I'm still looking at the wall and they fire practice shots near me, so I'm aware of the um like beside my head, side of my head, and I'm aware of the sort of spatial awareness of it, and even one towards me, and I duck out the way and then I've done it where I say go and I duck and they fire all next to me, and I reach into the reach into the um melee of them all and catch it. But the most recent one I did was they all got fired at me. So I wear a bulletproof vest and they just fire into my chest and I catch one. And I wanted to catch it in my hand because that felt believable semi-believable to my mouth. Um, but uh so I'm looping back to the fear of it. Yeah, it's scary getting them fired at me, and I've uh they hit me, they don't hit the vest, I've had one hit my neck, I've had one hit my groin. Um and it is painful in rehearsals and in performance. Uh and it's scary, which is why I don't want to do it much, and I used to whoever's fired it for me, I like make sure they are a good shot. But sometimes the airflow in the room or the pain ball can just curve and it yeah, it's uh not nice. But how do I come? You asked how I how do I come around from creating it? It was sort of working working backwards because I knew I wanted basically I knew I wanted to end up with my hands. How do I get into my hand secretly? That's that's that. Um so that's yeah, the working backwards on it, and uh yeah, Goodwin was a massive help with that method too. Um and it's attention writing this the structure of the story of it all because he understands that better than anyone else.
SPEAKER_02:Now I know that this isn't a real bullet, and you're not gonna die from it, but there is still an element of danger going on there. So, how do you deal with making that routine as safe as you can?
SPEAKER_00:Um just a lot of practice, really. So, my last show I had James Wentz, um, friend of mine, uh Amazon Magician, uh shoot the paintball gun. And so just a lot of practice um and making sure he's a good shot. And other than that, I can't other than that, I I'm wearing a I'm wearing a bulletproof vest, I'm wearing a visor, so I'm my face is covered, that I'm not gonna have an Anson Deck um moment. But that's all I can really do is hope that James is a good shot and I'm wearing protection. Oh, at one point I also uh earlier in the show I do a phone smash routine with metal blocks as the phone. I take out one of the I take out one of those, I put it down my pants to protect there as well. Um, it's just a nice little callback. Um, but really it's not like uh sort of a bullet catch where nothing's actually firing. You still have to be safe. Oh, what if something they are just being fired at me? And so there's not much I can do other than just ask James to not hit my groin, um, which he still did. He still did. Um, or Taylor McMorgan when he hit my neck, and it like you see in the video, it swerved and just and I dropped to the floor. Um, yeah, that hurt a lot. Uh but there's nothing, nothing more than other than just like, please be a good shot, and I'm wearing the right protection. I have to sort of go for it. Also, I'm putting my hand into the fire, into it, and I can't but the performer of me wants to get hit because it looks great when I bam and like and it hit my arm and I'm like walking towards the camera and sort of covered in hits, and it doesn't look good. So I'm sort of it it's one of those things where it it is painful, but you get over it. You sort of get over it. I I usually um whenever I do the show in rehearsals, ask the person to hit me once and we video it for a video to be like, oh, it does hurt, and like have a video of me getting hit and maybe showing a bruise. So I do sort of take a hit each show generally, um, just for theatric. It's horrible, but you sort of push through it.
SPEAKER_02:Are there any clips of you doing this as well?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's also on my Instagram. A lot of yeah, a lot of the reveal uh the me getting hit. You have to scroll back a little bit because I you know did it a few years ago in Saudi, but yeah, that is on my Instagram we're doing it. I might upload the full the full video. I'm quite proud of that. I got the I got that show I did earlier this year filmed, and I was like, you know what, I'll edit it because like I wanna know exactly how it looks. It was a multi-camera shoe, and they were like, Oh, by the way, the footage is so big we have to send it on a hard drive, you can't kind of just airdrop it to you, sort of thing. And I've looked at this files, and I've got it, and now I've got to learn colour grading, I've got to learn editing, and I've taken a bit enough way more than I can chew. It was in February, and I still not even really started it.
SPEAKER_02:So well, I think that's a great one in at number six. So we're on the tail end of your eight now. What's in at number seven?
SPEAKER_00:This is a trick that uh I'm proud of having consulted on because there's uh I wanted to add a consulting trick on this, and it's dynamo's phone in a bottle. So uh this trick was in the live show. Um, so he did it on the TV, you know, and it absolutely blew him up and the world of magic. Uh, there were, I think, a few years where every single person at a gig would mention Dynamo's phone in a bottle. It was just relentless. Um, and I think as I said earlier, it just hit in the right way. A very organic, a guy on the street, after a phone, after a bottle, bam, impossible object, and also left unresolved. He just left it with him, which I think creates a funny talking point of memory when describing the trick as well. You know, did you see that the other day? This is what happened, and um, and so then when it came to the live tour, it was called Seeing is Believing, and we had to take tricks that you'd seen on TV and put them onto a live show, and we knew phone and bottle needed to be done. And so a team of us, me, Paul Keeve, Rory Adams, Bob Pound, um we got working on it and created the effects, and we did it live hundreds of times around the world, where a performer would come on stage, a bottle was emptied by another performer and by another spectator. He takes their phone, shoves it in a bottle, it's called and verified as theirs, and they go off with it. And just very proud of it, very, very proud that we managed to bring such an iconic trick to life. Um, I think, you know, an important trick in magic, I think, in some ways, in UK magic. So memorable, I think, looking back. Um, and also, you know what you mentioned earlier about the little details of tricks. That to me is like the perfect example of like how much work goes into an effect. Because for that effect to take place, like just this, there needs to be a bottle where the label is covering the phone when it's in there secretly. So we had to get custom labels made. So buy all the bottles that fit the fit phones, and phones are getting bigger and bigger and bigger these days. So that was difficult. Steam the label, scrape off the label, make sure the bottles are clean, get our own labels printed, the right designed up, stick them on. Oh no, they don't tear off easily. So when you can't verify, it's theirs. Okay, stick them onto tracing paper, cut them out, spray mount those onto the bottle. So when you peel it away, there's still residue left. So it looks like it was a real label, but not, but you'd leave a corner so you can peel it easily. Like all these little things just for the label touch. Um, like that's half of it. Just the amount of things that go into a trick, and I love that. I love refining it, and um yeah, it's just it sort of sums up the amount of detail that goes into something, I think. Very fond of the whole trick and and the memory of it too.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I remember seeing the one honest TV special, and exactly like you said, every gig that I did past that point, they spoke about uh or they would make a comment like, Oh, are you gonna put my phone in a bottle now? Um So it was such an iconic trick, and one would presume not knowing method and not really minding uh about about method or wanting to know the methods to them. I'm presuming that the method used on the TV show was probably more accessible than being able to do an it in a live show, hence why you had to find a new method for it in the live show. But even in terms of what you guys must be doing backstage to allow that to happen, I certainly remember seeing Darren's show and seeing the lovely moment where the finger ring is placed on the stem of the glass, and not only was it a beautiful moment, but it was when the glass was handed to the audience member to take away. At that moment, the magician in your head is going, My god, what has just been done to achieve that backstage? How many people are you know making sure that everything's in the right place at the right moment to accomplish that moment? And it must be the same. You backstage, I know you mentioned earlier on you do a lot of backstage stuff. The amount of work that you must be doing to allow that moment to happen as well.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it was a real uh intense operation. Also, the speed it has to happen at live, because as you said, like TV has uh the fortunate ability to be able to jump around in time, right? Like if something takes a long time to you just you talk, you cut that out on TV, and it's been very quick. So we needed to match that feeling, and so um it all happened within a very quick amount of time, and uh it what was me, it was me doing it, doing the stuff, and I also wasn't backstage, if that kind of makes any sense. It made for a very fun, intense sort of you know, scenario. Um, if I can kind of imply that. Um so yeah, that's yeah, again, that's what's so satisfying about it. The more you know about it, which obviously I can't say, but the more you know about it, the more you go, that's what made that trick such an incredible trick to achieve was how much went into it. And so memorable that that audience when they when it happened, there was a cheer of shock, but also a cheer of like they got to see their favourite trick play out.
SPEAKER_02:How do you go from this thing that was on TV? How do you start creating that in the real world? That do you know what that to me it feels like you've gone, let's watch I don't know, how to train your dragon, and there's a dragon, well, we need to do that in a theatre now. It it just feels like you've taken something that's absolutely near on impossible and made it a reality in in a theatre setting.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, well, um basically outside of our industry, there are people who know bottles and glass and everything else better than we do, so let's get them involved. That is you know, like that that's the answer. Um basically get someone who's more experienced to learn that to work it out for us, essentially. Uh the main part of the method, I guess we're talking about there. Uh, and everything else, yeah, backtracking it on what needs to happen. Um we know we need to call it, we know how do we get the phone off or on, and um yeah, but making it play in the room was was very difficult because yeah, we didn't want any sort of also the arena stage was so big ringing on stage crew and stuff was so noticeable it it couldn't be done in the same way we did in the uh you can also couldn't we explored doing it in the audience, making it happen in the audience, um, but didn't quite again the um the fact of the size of the room into all those all the restrictions, it's just it became very difficult, but uh we we got there in the end.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think that's a great one in at number seven. So let's go to number eight, your final selection. What did you put in your last spot?
SPEAKER_00:Uh I have put in uh Toxic Plus E and Pigeons Eye Thump. And the reason it's there is because I sort of I say annoyingly, I think annoyingly in uh I think it's a perfect trick. And I say annoyingly because I kind of wish from a magic point of view that it might be a bit like a better one out there in some ways, but the it is I perform it every night in a maze, and I performed it in close-up, and if I do a corporate, it's there, like, and it's so hard to follow, although we do follow it in a maze. Um it is a show stopping moment. You can start a relationship on it, it is incredible when it happens, and I think it's the perfect trick because it's different from anything else, any feeling thing in the show. It's modern, it uses a phone, doesn't Feel like you know, he doesn't use cards like a magic prop. They're all doing it at the same time, so they all get the reaction. It has a kicker to it, it's unexpected, they all see it, they all share it. Um, and it works with three one person as well as it does with 3,000 people, and um it's just it is an incredible effect, and I'm a huge fan of it. Uh, and I say annoyingly, I think because also everyone does it, and it's hard to get rid of in your set, and you're like, Well, how can I replace this? Nothing else gets this reaction. Um I think that's why I say annoyingly, because we're not the only ones doing it, but I I love it as such as an effect.
SPEAKER_02:I think you're spot on. I think also it is the most incredible trick. And what was really interesting when Toxic Plus came about was the big thing was don't use your own phone, use their phone. So you would borrow their phone, you would do the necessary shenanigans, and then you would hand their phone back, and then they could do it on their own phone. And then Toxic Plus came about, which was something on your phone, which you know allowed this thing to happen, but there's sort of a counterintuitive thinking there because they are still using their phones, but they're doing en masse, as in this isn't just one person, this is an entire theatre of people. Now, think about that. Other than like Woody Aragon's love ritual, there are so few tricks where an entire stadium, as you were just saying, like you could get an entire stadium doing this trick. It's phenomenal.
SPEAKER_00:It really is, it truly is. Um there's just nothing else like it. There's nothing else like it. I'm a big fan of um tech magic phone tricks, like uh WikiTest is a I've got probably more gigs from WikiTest than I have anything else. I love it. I think it's phenomenal by Mark Kirstein. Uh, but um on the island there's no Wi-Fi, I'm guessing. So I'm having to do um toxic. I do this, but yeah, there's just nothing else like it that gets that reaction in the moment. I I love it.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think it's a great way to close out your list. So let's quickly visit your list before we go on to your final three. We had a ring flight, sneak thief, uh, deck of cards in the moniker. We had your silent painting routine, we had spooked, paintball bullet catch, phone in bottle, and toxic plus. That's a pretty diverse list, if I do say so myself.
SPEAKER_00:Yes, yeah. Well, yeah, it would be very different if I had to choose my working set. But these are this two of these kind of represent my life in magic, I feel. Like my yeah, that sort of sums me up. I think if I saw those those eight on the list, I'm like, yeah, that's that's me.
SPEAKER_02:Well, we've given you eight tricks, but you're allowed one each of the next thing. So I want you to imagine, Harry, that you're about to dig a big sandy hole on your island and you're gonna throw something inside from the industry never to be seen again. What would you like to banish onto your island?
SPEAKER_00:Props that don't reflect well on magic, I think. So I'm very aware of like that we're fighting misconceptions and judgments about magic. Like, we're always like in a siticcom, magicians are the butt of a joke, and like magic, certainly in the UK, certainly, is you know, still an outsider art form, and people have their opinions on magic because their weird uncle does a trick, or a guy at a bar learn tricks to pick up girls. Like it's it, it's not quite like a pure we've not got the respect of everyone. It is cool, people love it, but you know, yeah, it's not it's not that it's not cool, it's just we're fighting misconceptions, I think, a lot of the time. And I've got a big thing about when magicians then use props that don't help that. And I think stage uh stage is different to close-up because stage is a performance, but close-up and so yeah, someone who does it really well, by the way, who can use who does use weird props is Ben Hart. Like he can have and like Zabrecki, like because they've got like a character, they can use these weird props and it feels great because of the character. But if you're just a gigging performer and you don't have like a a character, pulling out sponge balls or like like a certain well, there's one I'm gonna put on and put it in in a minute, it's so niche. Um, to me, just doesn't paint magic in like a cool modern pushing it forward light, if that makes sense. I'm not against like if you see if I'm if you're a kids' magician, do sponge balls because kids love spongeballs and stuff. But if you're an an if you're like at a corporate and you bring these things out, basically the thing I'm gonna mention, well, I'll tell you now, it's ring on rope, is such a magic prop. And I've been at gigs, multi-man gigs, and another magician has pulled out a ring and a rope, and then don't get me wrong, the tricks are strong, but they're they're great moments of magic. But I watch the audience, the the group he was performing to sort of snigger a little bit at like the oh he bought you know he bought these his little toys along, sort of thing. It's just such an alien thing. Like, why do you have like where else do you ever see ever a piece of rope that's just one meter long that is just like that randomly? Like outside of like an industry, just it's not like an everyday thing, or a big shiny silver. It's just it's so proppy to me. And it's not I hate the trick, it's that I just want I want magic to be seen in a better light and I want to push it forwards, which is why I said earlier about my tricks as trying to feel as organic as possible, or just not weird, like sure I'm using a paintball butt gun, like you just buy them. But do you know what I mean? I've got a huge rant here, but I I hope my theory on that kind of comes across.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I I understand where you're coming from. It's almost uh it can almost be equated to the way that we dress as well. So, for example, if you have a character where you're wearing a tracksuit, right? If that's your character, then it works. If you're at a corporate event and you're wearing a tracksuit, it feels a bit bizarre uh in in that situation. And your prop should reflect exactly as you said earlier on, your character and the environment that you're working in. But equally, I think what you're what you're almost saying as well is that magic is caught in time, and those props are also caught in time, and the idea that you can take the ring on rope, which is a fantastic, fantastic plot, and I've seen some incredible people do it, but maybe just find a way to modernize it, find a way that that could work in a different environment.
SPEAKER_00:Either modernize it or take your character to a point where that is now acceptable. So if your character is I'm performing classic, classic magic, then like you can then present it in that way. But it feels to me when I'm watching close-up workers, one second they're doing wiki tests with a phone, then they're pulling out a rope, and you're like, what is going on? It's so weird and like yeah, what what do you think the audience are thinking about this prop and you in this moment? I think also it comes from a massive insecurity of being worried what people are thinking of me. Like, I've got I've got that hang up being so insecure about that stuff, and I want to try and control that or limit the bad thoughts, you know? You just I want to I think I think because I went through so much of that school. I think I was the weird kid who had all these weird prop props. And when I was 16, I was doing gigs and I was turning up to parties wearing a three-piece suit, and everyone else was dressed in t-shirt, and I felt like so now I'm so aware, hyper aware of like what I wear at a gig because how that makes me come across that I'd rather seem underdressed and overdressed, maybe in certain events, because let the magic through the talking, and I just got a lot of uh insecurities about what people think, and I want and I think the prop we use the props we use should be factored in.
SPEAKER_02:Do you think that context would help? So do you if if that corporate magician had that ring and rope, but they added a context wherein they're talking about maybe their childhood, and they had this piece of rope that was, you know, part of a rope swing in the garden, and they kept it from that house when they moved away. You know, do you think that someone could get away by changing the context?
SPEAKER_00:Certainly. Um I think stage allows for that more than close-up. But the question I'd I sort of ask is Is that the right time you'd be telling that kind of story in a drinks reception? Is it and is it is it still weird? Because then because then the story is you go, Yeah, I was having a wedding, and then a guy came over and he started telling us a story about his childhood and a rope. The story on stage would be a beautiful presentation of it, but also just like that's not the that's not the right time to be delivering that kind of story or trick, I don't think. Um, not saying close-up can't have story to it, it can absolutely, but I would just still question that. Uh because then the question is, yeah, a guy came over and he still pulled out a big ring and a rope, but he's holding this from his childhood. Like it's context, it's contextual. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Well, that is gone. So everyone on your island is being more mindful of the props they're using. Um, that is all done for you. Now we've got two more things. We have a book and an item. So let's go for your book. What did you put in your book position?
SPEAKER_00:I mean, anyone listening to this who knows me would be laughing right now because they know I'm not a big reader of magic. Uh, which is a I I I wish I was. I wish I'm I've never been a big reader. I don't know if it's because I'm not a I'm my brain is all over the place and stuff. Um like I I even struggle with podcasts these days because my brain, like I'm listening to something, I'll write something down and forget and Google that thing, and I'm not good, my attention span is bad. So reading is not good for me like that. Um so that is that that's that. But I've got two things I mentioned. Well, one is one is a book that I tried to be better at, The Magic Book, which was Josh J's Talk About Tricks, which is a huge, huge so heavy. Don't buy it until you have until you know you're in your house for life. Because how I've moved flat three times with this box set, and it's it's like 10 kilograms. It's huge, it's insane. Um, can't put it on a shelf because it will collapse the shelf. Um, it's insane. Um, someone told me early on, Josh very kindly gave it to me, and someone told me uh when Josh gave it to me, he goes, You should every day just read one trick because it's got like 800 tricks in it, and that's how you sort it. I have breakfast, read one trick. So I think if I was better at reading, that's what I would do. Because I started doing that and I just stopped because I don't have breakfast. Um, but I think it would be that possibly, or I think actually this is the answer. Is Darren Brown's notes from a fellow traveler? Because I think uh I am halfway through. But I'll say this, I make notes through it. I was there and I scribble in it, highlight, post it notes and stuff because I that's how I feel like I'm learning it more than if I just I think if I just read it and just read it and read it, and I would forget a lot of it. So I'm like trying to study it. I think it's very from everything I've read so far, um it's a very important book, and unlike anything else, in terms of theory, thinking on creating, writing, and performance from someone who has done it better than anyone else. He's he's the best that ever has been, and so I think that is a very important book. You can get tricks elsewhere, but that that is the book. And I say all this, I haven't finished it. I haven't like, and I and I I'm embarrassed by that. I'm just not good at reading, and that is a uh a huge fault of mine.
SPEAKER_02:We we've put book in here, uh, but I I always want to reiterate this. It people that aren't great at reading or aren't confident, that that should never be a thing that anyone looks down on. We all learn differently. We may change it in the future to maybe favorite DVD or you know, favorite download or uh because of the way uh things are going on. But you will love getting to the end of this book, it's superb.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, thank you. Thank you. I I think I say keep book in there because I think actually we should keep books alive. Like this sounds for someone who's not talking about that is where all the gems are. Um, and I I I I should be better and I want to be better at that stuff. Um, but there is one thing I would recommend everyone else reading, um, if I could add that, which is the instructions to wiki test, because the amount of customer support that Mark has to do, and it's all in the instructions, so just read the instructions, please. Because I'm every there's not a time I'm out with him when he is not doing some wiki test support, replying with it's in the instructions screenshot. So please, everyone else read that.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, I feel like that's an honorable banishment. People not reading instructions. There you go.
SPEAKER_00:Yes, yes. I'm I mean to be fair, I'm I'm just to blame. You know, you get the prop. Do not use this until you've watched the DVD. I'll have a little look.
SPEAKER_02:I'll have a little look. It's true. Um, but I think Notes from a Fellow Traveller is a brilliant choice. Um, and the the last thing that I'll say on that is I think it's so interesting that a book feels like it's a lifetime's worth of work, but that's one tour.
SPEAKER_00:Yes. Yeah, I feel we're very lucky to have that book, and we're lucky to have him. One, I think a huge career highlight was being able to work with him on his last tour and um seeing him work and rehearse and write, and he is uh the greatest as a performer. I've just never seen anything like it. In his work ethic, and um yeah, this book, which I still haven't finished, is the best.
SPEAKER_02:It's amazing. Now, uh before we move on, just because you've mentioned that book, we've had uh a good a very good number of people mention this book, but something seems to come up a lot, uh, specifically from people that have worked with Derum. He has signed many of these books, but he signed them in strange and mysterious ways. So have you had your book signed and has he signed yours in a strange or mysterious way?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, he wrote uh a few sweet things, one of which was that he adores me, which is very, very sweet. But also, I say that or I don't know, he could have wrote that everyone's. So um that is very sweet. A lovely little I've not looked at that since he signed it, which is really um really lovely. There's a few little messages, some about work, one about work and one about that, and um oh, that's very yes. Um by the way I know he has done comedy ones and stuff in the past, um, which is very good.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think that's a great uh choice uh for your book, and you're gonna love the the ending of it. I think it's great. But it does lead us on to your very final item. So, what was your non-magic item that you use for magic?
SPEAKER_00:It is my phone, but I know that seems very broad because I've otherwise I could just do wiki tests and toxic and stuff. Uh, but I am limiting myself. I'm allowed one app and it's a WhatsApp and it's a WhatsApp group. I'm my WhatsApp group chat with my group of closest friends, uh, of which Mark's on there, and Neb and Pete He and Gareth, Martin, Roland, and Dan Farrell. And uh, it's the best WhatsApp group you could ever imagine. Of course, everyone's WhatsApp groups are the best. Um, but the reason is, is and the reason it's for magic because we push each other on there and improve each other massively. Not actually, you know what, not just in magic, but in life. Like we're all very supportive and just like there for each other. Um so like if someone's going through a bad time, it's a good group of friends, but you know, especially COVID and things like that. Like without, you know, without COVID, I don't without that group in COVID, I don't know what I would have done. Um, but also when it comes to like an email comes in, we are confused about how to price, put on that group, whatever, or you know, um, you know, got an is an issue with a client. Like it's it's a really useful group in terms of that. Of course, it's also got all the gossip. All the gossip. If that gets leaked, we are cancelled. Not from the industry, but um not for bad, not like bad tags. It makes it sound that makes it sound really bad. But I just like it's just gossipy um and very funny. We just it's a good group, but yeah, personal things has helped me with, but also just in magic, we push each other and we grow and we put new ideas on there, and so that is what helps me with magic the most, I think. And so I think I get the most out of that. Because um, so that is my uh also I need Mark for WikiTest support because I haven't read the instructions either. So uh just every now and then I need to go, how do I do that? Yeah, um, I mean, but it it's not even just tricks, but like the other day Pete got an inquiry and was like, Oh, they saw me here, but how I charge this much, how much should I charge to go to Vegas for this one? Like, just very useful sort of stuff. But then also, um oh, Pete put a video up of him going, I'm planning on posting this on social media, what do you think? And we went, how about this? How about that instead? What if you filmed it like this? And just we just push each other and help each other, and like like we've all grown for that reason. Um, and I am better because of them. And personally as well, personally, like the growth we've all we've all made and push each other and also like a lot of the stuff I do, I feel fearful of what they're gonna think, and that helps me be better, right? You know, what if they heard me say this or do this, or that's an embarrassing Instagram caption. What if Neb saw that and yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think that's a great choice. I think it's really important to have a group of people who are like-minded who you can confide in. Um, certainly when you're a creative magician, having trust in people, I think it's really important to, you know, know that if you have an idea, number one, they're not going to ridicule you for it, which you know sometimes can happen. And it stops you being creative if if we're entirely honest. Other people's opinions of us. Um, but I think it's so lovely that that that group there is is always there for you to you know confide in and help you move along.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, they they've all got such good skill sets as well, like uh how funny they are as well, who can punch up jokes. But like people like Mark have got such a a very logical brain, and he can really find what the missing link is on certain things. And uh yeah, it just I can talk about them uh and their strengths for hours, but we've taken hours on this.
SPEAKER_02:So well, that's a great way to close out your list. Let's go over it one more time. We had ring flight, sneak thief, deck of cards in the moniker. We had silent painting routine, uh, we had spooked, paintball bullet catch, phone in glass bottle, toxic plush. Your banishment is being more mindful of the props you're using. Your book is notes from a fellow traveller, and your item is a phone with your WhatsApp group chat on. What a great list.
SPEAKER_00:You can you you can put ring on rope specifically as a banishment because that can get in the bin.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, we'll put that on there specifically.
SPEAKER_00:I say ring, but I'm about the big ones. I'm not about wedding ring on a shoelace. That feels a little bit more organic. I'm okay with that.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, we'll let that one in there. So I'll I'll put on their big ring on rope um going forward. Uh, but if people want to find out more about you, Harry, and the shows that you're in and all of that good stuff, where can they go to?
SPEAKER_00:Pretty much Instagram at Harry DeCruz. That's where I post stuff. Not often, but that's where if I'm doing something, that's where I'm gonna be posting about it. Yes, at the moment, um in New York and New World Stages, which is an off-broadway theatre. Uh, we're at stage five. Uh, come along, got Christmas season coming up. Um, but that is it for now, really. And then go and see Darren Brown when he goes back on tour in February, March with Only Human. That's back on tour doing another leg, which is very exciting. Um, go see it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I think he starts back off at my local theatre again. Um, he started in February back in Bromley.
SPEAKER_00:It would be very interesting to hear your thoughts because you saw the other first opening week, and we're interested to see how much a lot has changed, but it's I saw Andrew O'Connor the other day, and he said um, he goes, We're now uh polishing, we're not fixing, which is nice. They they you know they fix and fix and fix for a little while, and then he goes, now we're like making it better. So yeah, so I'd love to hear your thoughts on it.
SPEAKER_02:We've got tickets to um in March, I think, in Canterbury. So we're having an Alakazam outing and when we're all gonna go down and see it.
SPEAKER_00:There is a perfect link there. Do you remember when he did Big Bang? Yes, remember this? He said Big Bang, Alakazam is what he said in his special. Do you remember that? His TV special, he does Big Bang the trick, and he literally says where to buy it from. And I love that. Yeah, what a great bit of promo. Big bang, Alakazam.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, he is. He's so so so great, and yeah, really, really looking forward to seeing the show again. Um, but the last thing that I want to talk to you about before you go, and we I just sort of mentioned it at the head of the podcast, is your work with the Young Magicians Club, and you've actually referenced it a few times in the podcast. Uh in during your list, and and you go into YMC and that you learnt some of the tricks there. So tell us about your involvement in YMC and and it going forward.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so it's the youth initiative of the magic circle. I did it from when I was well, it's from the ages are 10 to 18, and I did it from 10 to 18. Um, and it is the best place for kids to learn magic, I think, in the turning in a community because when you're when you're at school, you don't know any other magicians. But here, every month we have 70 kids turn up and they're all chatting and learning magic together. We've got the best in the world lecturers coming to there to teach. And it just helped me so much with my magic journey, is where I met friends for life. It's where I got to learn the magic I still perform to this day. And also now I'm friends with some of those lecturers that I met and stuff. It's so really sweet because magic is such a great small industry like that. And then a couple of years ago, a few years ago, um, it was announced that Kevin was the chair at the time, stepped down, and me and Edward Hilson, who we met at YMC, um, took it on. And it was one of those things where actually we didn't even think really about doing it. It was like that was it was like a calling. It was like, that's what we're gonna do, we're gonna set that on. And so we've been running for the last three years with your help and a great workshop team of people. Um, and seeing it come strength to strength, and seeing the kids and the community and how lovely they are and how proud we are. I think Rafferty is about to be on Britain's Got Talent next year. I think he's just auditioned. Um, I'm sure Harry will soon. Like it's just like so proud of the kids and what they've achieved as a culture, as a group. Um, and if you're a magician listening to this and you want to help out, get in touch because it's the next generation of magicians that we're all pushing forwards. And you know, and before we know it, we're gonna be I I can I can predict that it in 10 years' time, one of those kids will set come to me for like a consulting job or something, and I'm gonna be they're gonna be the ones on TV, and like that is our future, and so helping them um meet us, it's one of the most proudest things I've ever done. It really is. I I love it so much, and um I just know how much it helped me, and so I'm looking forward to seeing it, what it does for them.
SPEAKER_02:You're spot on there, and like you said, I I saw it many years ago when Kevin uh was a part of it, and it was great then, don't get me wrong, they did such a superb job, but I think the relatability I think that you and Edward bring to the table as well. Um, you're people that the kids look up to as well, which I think is really nice because you were where they were, and I think that's what's so unique about that position. Um, and like you said, uh Rafferty as well, shout out to Rafferty is just a phenomenal talent, and I know that when I've spoken to him, I think he gives he he gets a lot from the YMC and you know what one of our previous guests on this podcast, Henry Ferris, as well, an amazing talent, it's great. And seeing these kids and the confidence that they have there, and it's the fact that when you go to the magic circle, these kids come from all over the country, they're they're all different demographics, but they're so supportive of each other. If there's a kid sitting on their own, another kid will just go over to them and and start talking. It's such a lovely environment, it's really lovely, yeah.
SPEAKER_00:That's ball different ages, well, different classes, cultures, it's they're so they're so good, that community. Um, I was gonna say also as a place, we know that getting better to be better at magic, you need to perform, and that is a place where they can go and perform every single month, and so that's why we're seeing them seeing them grow, and we don't get much time with them each month. So, well, our plan is just to give them tasters of as much magic as possible, let them go off and and learn. So, um, yeah, I can't wait to see what it becomes and how it grows. And our vibe that Edward and I wanted, because Kevin was a was a school teacher, uh, and so in my pitch to the foundation for the role is maybe not the best pitch, but I basically went, I want it to feel a bit like the supply teachers are in, school's out, kind of vibe. You know what I mean? Like sort of Harry might let us make a zip wire off the balcony if we ask him, sort of vibe. Because they've spent all week at school. They come to us on a Saturday, then have some fun.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think you've uh you've achieved that in spades. I really do. Uh so if you are a magician and maybe you've got a lecture and you feel like contributing to the YMC, then please do reach out to them. If you're just someone that can spare some time to help out, please do. It's a great, very, very rewarding uh thing to do. And you know, we need to help as many young people come up through the industry.
SPEAKER_00:Also, if you've got any tricks at the bottom of your drawer that you do not use, I can tell you young magicians love tricks. Um, but any of that, lectures as well and all that kind of stuff. Or if you want to write something for the magazine for the kids, we have a magazine. Um, our email address is uh go for harry at youngmagiciansclub.co.uk and um get in touch. But as much as you can help, but yes, the YMC is a big part of the future of magic. Also, it has been some of the big names have come from there. Um, Ben Haas been through there, Steve Della's one through there, James Moore, an anthony illusionist, and Chris Cox, Andy Gladwin, Richard Young, Will Houston, Hilson, uh Dom Chambers from AGT and um um and that kind of stuff. Julius Dean was on there, Tom Elderfield, Luke Oslin. That's there's so many, so many names.
SPEAKER_02:Amazing. Well, thank you so much for giving your time, Harry. It really is nice to finally have you on here, and we we all wish you the very best on the continued run in a maze. Thank you very much. Thanks for having me. Sorry if I've rambled and ranted too much, but there you go. You haven't at all. Um, and of course, thank you all for listening. We will be back next week with another episode. But until then, I hope you all have a great week. Goodbye.
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